good morning or well good afternoon uh to all of you um thank you adicio for giving me this opportunity to talk to you and share my experience on mycotoxins how they affect the animals functioning the reproductive digestive and the respiratory system and what can be done about it so we will first highlight a little bit the well the situation globally then the mode of action of the different um mycotoxins and then my well what i am a vet i will highlight the veterinary aspects of mycotoxins in more species but of course my expertise is poultry and so i have a small video to show you where you can find the lesions in poetry then diagnosis is very important and not easy for mycotoxins and then what can you do about it so if we look globally today and abiso contributes to examine and and make um take samples from different parts of the world to see what is the situation what we see is that a lot of our animal feeds are contaminated with mycotoxins there are aflatoxins xeralion uh feminisms dom okra toxin and very often they come together if you find one mycotoxin usually you have more of them that is the rule when we look at those samples and then what we also or what is not always clear is that what is the effect of the subclinical levels of mycotoxins say as we say usually it is multi-contamination and different mycotoxins all in different levels and they also have a synergistic effect so one plus one is three in case of microtoxins most of the samples that we find can even comply with the european regulations or recommendations on levels of microtoxin and what is the maximum tolerable concentration in feeds and we have regulations on that but we also know that even if they do not reach that level there is still an impact on perform there is still an impact on performance and health of the animals so we are talking here of a not so easy to diagnose problem and a problem that is mostly underestimated because we have we measure mycotoxins very often but we also have metabolites from the mycotoxins that also have an effect or modified microtoxins and recently research has also shown shown that there are many emerging mycotoxins where we still have to examine the effects like the enyatins bouvericin all these things are still to be examined so here we have a few overviews or or examples of samples that have been examined all over the world and we have some figures from um cereals and corn in poland spain but also us france uk brazil and so russia and so this is really a global concern and there's not one country that can say we do not have also in belgium on our wheat that we harvest here we also sometimes have microtoxins and so as we said um it is a global threat and what we fear is that with changing climate conditions this is not going to reduce but it's probably going to enhance the occurrence of mycotoxins so we will see that um and like we see with insects also and intermediate hosts of some of our parasites is that they are moving up with global warming so microtoxins today for our animals production animals is mainly what we are talking about today um is definitely a major problem right but we not always see a real acute disease like acute mortality or so the effect is more insidious so we have clinical or sub we have clinical disease but mostly we see subclinical disease and that is why we need more performing diagnostics to be able to also detect this so even if there is only low or moderate levels of toxins they can still have an effect on metabolic physiologic immunologic functions of the animals and so it will affect health and performance the other thing to be aware of is that there is a risk of human contamination depending on which products we are dealing with from the animals but we know like aflatoxin can pass in the milk of the cows we also know that there is proof of okra toxin aflatoxin in eggs so it can also contaminate the people eating the eggs and in meat although that is more rare but there is a possibility so one of the concerns of microtoxins is also human food safety so that is why monitoring in feed and food is important not only to determine can we use this raw material and for the quality of the feet but also food safety and then the next step that we are coming to now slowly with biomarkers is how can we measure exposure in the animals because that is what we want to know how much risk is my chicken or pig or cattle at by eating this kind of feet so the different mycotoxins in this table i wanted to highlight their mode of action and then also the main target organ i know this is not a complete list but when we talk aflatoxin and we know this has an effect on your dna rna in the liver mainly it also is carcinogenic but the organ that we will uh in the lesions of acute intoxication the target organ is definitely for aflatoxin will be the liver so for the trichotickins and don t toxin they have more an impact on protein synthesis so they will inhibit this protein synthesis which of course is happening in different parts of the body but the main effects that we will see is intestinal mucosa and it is caustic for the intestinal mucosa also for the skin but as i said i wanted just to highlight the main target organ and to make it easier for in the field to what organs are we going to look at for the different mycotoxins we know that has a big effect on estrogen receptors so of course the reproductive organs here will be the target main target organs as well in the male as in the female then feminism has in they can inhibit the sphingolipid biosynthesis which is very much implied in the nervous system so that is why with these um mycotoxins we very often see the clinical lesions in the nervous system although they also can affect intestinal tract we know that but as i said focus on the main target organ in clinical symptoms and then okra toxin a disturbs the physiology in cellular physiology in many ways but very often the first signs that we see are in the kidneys so that is um we will see in the different species okra toxin first clinical signs or lesions we will find in the kidneys so let's come to what my talk is about um what as a vet or what are the the health science that we can see in mycotoxins in the different species and then focus on poultry because that's my expertise so if we look at the different microtoxins we can see that they do have an impact on general animal health as we can see the circulatory system heart lungs respiratory can be affected also the brain we see some sometimes like even with aflaptoxin we can see paralysis uh sometimes in portuguese for example but we have other syndromes with the feminisms in quail or horses for example then the intestinal tract and that of course is very important because everything you put in the feed you put in that is contaminated with the mycotoxins so the first target will be there in the stomach and you will see how it affects really the the basic functioning of that intestinal tract and then the liver of course also a very together with the kidneys a very important organ for detoxification so if your mycotoxin is going to affect liver or kidney it will have a general impact because your normal detoxification processes are well compromised and then something else that i in my personal uh experience have come across a couple of times is that mycotoxins can have an effect on your reproduction breeding and what we know and um parent stock and so the mothers of the chickens we of the the chicks we want to produce if they are affected with mycotoxins this can have an effect on their performance but also on hatch ability and on the growth the quality of the dale chicks which is in poultry production one of our main targets that we want to achieve and then in general it affects the immune system that has been proven in many studies but this is something that is sometimes and we talk about subclinical levels how are you going to prove that the reason why you have so many other diseases in fact is because you have mycotoxins that compromise your body defense mechanism and so and in general if we look at the effects that mycotoxins can have on animal health it's always a mixture of all these three parts and you have the mycotoxin so of course this is going to the the dose that you have there the type of mycotoxin the time of exposure which is also a very important factor when we talk about clinical subclinical uh effects of microtoxins and the is it one mycotoxin but as we said very often you have multiple mycotoxins there so that is one aspect that is going to have an effect on what it's going to do to your animal right but also the animal itself of course depending on the species we know poultry for example they are maybe the less sensitive so what happens sometimes is that feedstuffs that are not going to be used in cattle and pigs because they are more sensitive species they are going to go into poultry feed and of course maybe the level is not going to be high enough to get clinical symptoms but it will still have an effect so species breed different layer birds or meat production birds but of course in pigs also you have the different categories dairy cattle or meat cattle age gender can have an effect if we talk about reproductive systems which will if your males are also affected it will have a general impact on fertility and health status of the birds if they are already well in less good condition because of parasites the oxidizes i don't know what it will also affect and of course functioning of the immune system in every species we have diseases or conditions that can affect your immune response and then the third factor also very important and cannot be neglected is of course the environment where we keep our animals and so good management biosecurity hygiene good conditions in general in the housing of our animals is important and will determine all these three factors together will determine what are you going to see in the fields so this is a slide that i borrowed from uh junker antonison a professor at the university of ghent and he's done a lot of work on micro toxins and i think this is very important for all the rest that we are going to develop because this talk slide talks about what are mycotoxin doing in the intestinal tract first of all what we see is that it's going to affect intestinal permeability and we see here the different mycotoxins all of them have an effect on the permeability which means that once you have mycotoxins in clinical or subclinical levels in your intestinal lumen it's going to affect those tight junctions between the intestinal epithelium and it's going to make that you get a leaky gut not only the mycotoxins but all other substances that are supposed to stay outside of the bird's circulatory system are going to be able to enter um the circulation so we have an effect on inflammation we have they induce oxidative stress which of course is something that is not compromising the normal functioning of your gaze and very important and there will be a shift in intestinal microbiota most mycotoxins will have an effect on that and will make for example that the commensal community of bacteria will be compromised and that pathogens or pathogens that are there gets the or take the opportunity to do harm in the intestinal tract so also an effect on local uh immunity iga production and recovery of your cells so cell proliferation is something that is needed to if you have an injury to recover and this is compromised in um with many of the mycotoxins so how would it this modulation of the intestinal function happen and even at subclinical levels you will looking at what happens in the former slide and you will see that there is an effect on the physiology immunology and the metabolic actions happening in the intestinal tract and the consequences are that it will affect your performance because there is no normal digestion and absorption of nutrients and because of the damage done by the mycotoxins this increased permeability will also compromise the normal mucosal barrier function to keep out the bad things and to absorb the good things and we will have in general as more susceptibility for any infectious disease so that's why the effect of microtoxins in the gut is so important so let's have a look at the different species what you will see in clinical manifestations of mycotoxins so that means that you already have a high level but you will have in swine but in all species reduced performance reduced performance also because the feed utilization and efficiency of digestion is compromised we get impaired fertility and you can sometimes see tale necrosis ear necrosis in swine skin lesions same in poultry reduced performance and one of the things we often see is the fatty liver an effect on egg production also on the quality of the eggs and we see sometimes meat spots blood spots due to microtoxins and in the end and because of a general um effect on performance you will get poor carcass quality and then in horses for example we have this syndrome where you see neurotoxic lesions and even in fish because don't forget this is also important for fish we will see that there are they have abnormal body conformation and also lesions that resemble a little bit what we see for example with um in in swine and that you see producer protrusion protrusion of the anus for example something that we can see in fish so aflatoxins main target organ the liver and you can see here we have a normal colored liver and all these are different levels of aflatoxin that cause fatty generation you also get liver affection in the pigs for example okra toxin a typical target the kidney and you can see a pig nephropathy so necrosis and and lesions in the kidneys as well in pigs as in in broilers where you can see swollen kidneys and then the effect on the reproductive uh tract of zerala neon here is what you see in young female pigs and also abortion and also an effect on the reproduction here what we see this is in um chickens where you see cystic oviducts this is a sign of and very important and this is a normal testicle of male chicken and here we see with mycotoxins atrophy of course this is not going to give you a lot of cheeks and then nervous signs in you see this poor horse suffering from equine leuko and cephalon malasi but also in quails we have a nervous system with nervous um disorders with this mycotoxin then if we look at dom and t2 and as i said the intestinal tract is very much affected by the caustic effect but also and the lesions that you see on the little pigment and the tail necrosis in this uh sow no it's not a cell it's a boar sorry i'm not a big specialist but i should be able to see this then uh one of the mycotoxins that we know for many years it's or even in some paintings of our famous peterborough where you see in humans skin necrosis but we also see that in this these are calves with skin necrosis here you see it in a chicken and here the ear neck roses in pigs and here are the fish effects that they saw in rainbow trouts where you see that the body of this fish is not completely normal a big belly and then the protrusion of these um this anus in fact eh and also you also see kidney and liver lesions and so this has all been uh described in literature and then what we i would like to come back to what i know best is poultry pathology and here we see and i have a small movie on that gastrointestinal lesions feathering the liver affected sometimes subcapsular hematomas egg quality what you see here is damaged on by um okra toxin and also kidney problem bruisings and the the blood clotting can be affected by mycotoxins and even lameness sometimes so let's uh watch together uh the video that we prepared for you on necropsy so what i want to show you is how we can do necropsy on this layer and we will focus on where you are looking for lesions caused by mycotoxins so these are normal feathers you will see with um some mycotoxins like trichotickins don you can have lesions of ab normal formed feathers so this is where you could see abnormalities when the feathers are not normally developed so this is how normal feet and toes look like in some conditions caused by mycotoxins specifically ericotaminus you can see necrosis of the toes so then we'll inspect the head and the mouth cavity where you can see here the huena that are clear it's the top part of the mouth in fact connected with the nose also and also the tongue this is a normal if you have mycotoxin intoxication in acute cases you can see lesions on the mucosa of the mouth here on the huena also the tip of the tongue can be necrotic it turns out black and you see kind of ulcers also on the side of the where the beak ends so we open up the abdominal cavity so this is a young layer and here you see the organs in situ immediately you can see the liver this is a reddish brownish that is a normal liver in cases of intoxication with a toxin for example you get fat deposit fatty degeneration of the liver so you will have more orange even yellowish liver color so we remove the intestinal package and what we can see here is a normal aspect of the intestines and you don't see any hemorrhages this can be the case in some intoxication with mycotoxins you can see hemorrhages on the intestine big spots of hemorrhage so then we will open up the stomachs and the proof ventriculus because they're also sometimes you can see lesions so this is the pro ventriculus that we open up and in some cases also because of mycotoxins you can see hemorrhages here in the proventriculus then we open up the gizzard because this is also where we will look for lesions and we remove the contents and then we look for ulcers so this is normal aspect of the gizzard inside so in case of mycotoxins you can find lesions ulcers here but mostly also on this side sometimes you can only see it when you remove the coal coaling layer so underneath but in fact all these ulcers are due to caustic effects of the mycotoxins so this is the inside of the desert the mucosa without the cooling layer and in case of intoxication with mycotoxins you can see ulcers um when you remove the coiling layer also sometimes even with the quality layer on top of it you can even find that in very small chicks maybe due to breeder intoxication so then we have a look this is a layer where you can see the immature of area it's a young layer and underneath you see the kidneys and this is the normal aspect of kidneys and they are um reddish brownish color and you don't see any um in case of mycotoxin intoxication for example with okra toxin you can sometimes find like or very swollen kidneys or signs of urates inside the kidneys so this is a young layer what we see here is an ovarian that is not yet developed but we know that some mycotoxins also affect the reproductive tract as well in the female as in the male where you can get regression of your ovarian and you can also get testicles that are undersized so a trophy of the testicles and of course this will have an effect on your fertility rate and hatchability so i hope you learned something from the necropsy session and um so what i want to highlight because in input reproduction this is of course very productive very important is the performance of the breeders and they can be affected by mycotoxins what we will see is that in bad cases even your feet intake will be lower and of course your feed conversion will go up your efficiency of transforming feed into meat or eggs is is lower so an effect on your production less eggs and even the ones that are produced can have reduced hatch ability the end product of breeder production is quality chicks so microtoxin can have an effect on your shell quality also on the hatching process because if your shell quality is not good during incubation you will have altered moisture loss and also the exchange of gases in uh bad quality shells is less good so it will have an effect on chick quality and more embryonic mortality and also sometimes we saw some of the the mycotoxins affect really dna and so you can really have deformations egg weight can be lower fertility goes down more mortality as well in the breeders as in their progeny and the czech quality goes down so if you look at egg production and embryonic mortality there is a connection in the sense that these studies are with effects of aflatoxin and okra toxin but also the other mycotoxins can have an effect on egg quality and embryonic mortality because as we said at the start there is the effect of your mycotoxin in the intestinal tract which will compromise nutrient absorption but also calcium and vitamin d tree absorption which you need for the production of a good quality shell and then in the liver you will have the protein synthesis that is compromised so that will also affect the transport of calcium in your circulation and also other pigments like vitamin a can that can also be affected by the mycotoxins and then in the kidney you have more excretion of calcium which means that there is less available for uh shell good shell production the plasma concentration of calcium and phosphorus is going down more calcium is going to be mobilized from the bones and this will result in thinner eggshells during incubation this has an effect on exchange of moisture and gases which will affect the condition of the embryo and you will get more embryonic mortality so here in these graphs you can see and the important is to note what i put there in green is that the concentrations were within the efsa regulation range but still you can see with different mycotoxin toxin aflatoxin and it also states when or the exposure uh of days also with don you have an effect on egg production and consequently also uh on um embryo mortality so these are the effects that you can see with exposure and as i say important to note is that it's not even in concentrations that are higher than what is determined in the regulation so what you saw in the graphs is a synergistic effect what we usually see with mycotoxin of okra toxin and aflatoxin and important to remember is that these mycotoxins can also be transferred to the egg so they have an effect on the cheek of the embryo so the embryo the chick there can be embryo mortality or a chick that is born but with a compromised immune system with lower transfer of antibodies through the yolk with lower weights of the immune organs the bursa fabrici and the thymus and so that makes that your chicks will be more susceptible to infections and you will have early mortality so then diagnosis as i said not always easy if you have subclinical infections with or or contamination with mycotoxins and then use as i said you see other diseases you see other problems and to relate that to mycotoxin can be a challenge so for example reduced touchability before you come to the feed of the the breeders and find microtoxins there sometimes that's a long way to go um because and also and in this case for example what we saw were ulcers in the gizzards of dale chicks and in the end we could prove that there was a problem with the feet of the breeders but of course there are other reasons why you can find ulcers in the stomach it can be high temperature in incubation or adenovirus for example so it's important to monitor in the feeds or the foods and for humans for quality of the feed and food safety for people but also for our and so already it starts for the monitoring it starts with the problem of the sampling because mycotoxin contamination is not uniform in a batch say you have a boat that arrives with corn from i don't know where um and you want to check for mycotoxins the way you sample is very important because you can have hot spots with contaminations and if you don't do a good sampling then you will have a problem so that is one aspect and the other one is that if we want to see or our mycotoxins implied in problems that i see in the animals then what we want to get in the picture is the exposure to mycotoxin in the animals and therefore or humans and therefore we make use of biomarkers so we will look at bodily fluids blood urine faces feces sometimes meat milk or eggs and then we will see um we will try to find the mycotoxins and also we can look at biomarkers of effects biomarkers that indicate inflammation biomarkers that indicate lower immune response for example important day i'm not a specialist in that but you have different analytical methods depending on what you want to proof or what you want to find and you have very specific qualitative and quantitative analysis and where for example for um legal regulations eh and some of them will like the high high-performance liquid chromatography and you can identify single mycotoxins you also have tests the liquid liquid chromatography mass spectrometry where you can have a different um or multiple analysis of different mycotoxins and then we have cheaper rapid screening tests in elisa and so they can give you a good idea but of course this is not a very um they are less sensitive so usually you will do a screening and then afterwards a more performing test so depending what you are looking for what type of matrix you are examining you will have a different test and then a brief word on the biomarkers because they are very useful because they will show you really in the animal what is happening there or what are the levels of mycotoxins so there is a lot of work going on uh in that area uh some of it is done at the university of gente where for example they looked at um to see if if some mycotoxin binders or detoxifiers what is the effect in the broiler or in the pig and therefore um we they saw that for pigs there is a good correlation between the concentration of mycotoxin in the feed and in the animal in the pig for broilers we are still on the way i'm sure we will soon find better biomarkers but so it's important when you um work with these biomarkers or look at results that you take into account is this the best marker in this for this mycotoxin for this animal eh because you can look for the mycotoxin maybe four metabolites of microtoxins what is the best matrix is it blood plasma is it urine is it feces it depends on the species on the mycotoxin also the timing is important so when are you taking this sample when you expect the exposure has taken place because that of course will influence the content the concentration of mycotoxin or maybe metabolites and then the toxic kinetics say for each mycotoxin is different so that is also something to take into account when you choose biomarkers and so we have good proof um there we have some um trials done in broilers for aflatoxin dom utta and for pigs with don and zerala neon that gave us some good results and so here in this study from tommy van lienbergen and he saw a good correlation between the feed and the plasma of dom higher level of done in the feeds a higher level of in the plasma and that was correlated to a tail necrosis in the piglets afterwards in the broilers the test that uh the trials that this is from a child that is is well probably not yet published but uh in any case they didn't see a very good relation so where the search for biomarkers in broiler is ongoing sorry so biomarkers say i would say in broilers the golden standard remains feed analysis and then control and prevention and we also have to as we saw what microtoxins can do we can do some symptomatic treatment try to support recovery intestinal health is very important there anti-inflammatory antioxidant support liver and kidney function and help detoxification it's because that is what the mycotoxins are doing damage and then important in your mycotoxin control is to have an integrated approach um it starts at the harvesting in the fields already when the plants grow and you have to go on with your surveillance until it reaches the animal so good agricultural practice and good manufacturing practice are necessary for that and the right processing techniques and then make sure there are good feed additives that can bind mycotoxins or can modify a microtoxins but you always have to be aware about efficacy and safety because if you overdose you might have a problem it can also for example capture vitamins and other needed substances and no there is no mycotoxin detoxifier that is universal for all mycotoxins so the substances that we use and they will suppress or reduce absorption of the mycotoxin they will also help excretion so that the exposure time is reduced and they can also have an effect on the mode of action of the mycotoxin so make sure that you be aware that if you use too much or the wrong binders that you can have a problem with minerals and nutrients that are absorbed so that's the end of my presentation my take home message for you is that you must be aware of mycotoxins it's a global concern and it's from many evidence sampling we know that um there are a lot of mycotoxins there and that sometimes they are um subclinical but they do have an effect um clinical symptoms are maybe rare but if you have them then you really have the tip of the iceberg okay but most commonly we see subclinical effects so it affects intestinal integrity immune response so more other diseases so important to do a good monitoring on the feed and the food to assure quality of the feed you give to the animals and to assure food safety for the human consumer and in the future i think we will find better methods to find or or give evidence of the mycotoxins in the animals with biomarkers so for the control we have to rely on an integrated approach from the field to our table and we have to avoid of course contamination before the feeds are ingested by our animals and if we have problems we need to focus on the target organs to make sure that we protect them so that our animals can be healthy and performing well sorry so with that i want to thank you for your attention and i'm ready to answer any questions if you want okay so we are back here on stage to answer your questions you can use the chat mode to type your questions and let me just explain that to the spanish and portuguese speakers as well uh bueno gracias is okay okay so uh first question uh let me just translate it how much how long is the time of explosion for a toxin uh to start to make an effect uh effect uh on uh on breeders and layers as that to dr julia dvorska uh yes this is very important for breeders from layers since they are living longer lives and than their broilers chicken and time of exposure uh depends on the type of the mycotoxins and the longer exposure the more effect we will have and the more pronounced negative effect we will we will see and it's also depends on many other many other factors like again type of mycotoxins and health issues any sanitary issues in on the farm for example if some challenges on the farm are also uh present so there are a lot of little factors which are important but again for for the layers and the for readers they're really important they can have effect even on progeny in breeders so if we have mycotoxin in feed of breeders we will have negative effect on all the systems including immune system antioxidant system of broiler chicken cheeks so including all the negative effects like degrees of freedom decreased fertility and decreased health status okay thank you our next question would be um the few levels of contamination showed in the presentation are very high what will be the impact in broilers of more real world levels let's say 5 to 15 parts per billion of alpha toxins or 200 to 250 to 750 ppb's of dawn or 500 to to 1500 parts per billion for monitoring uh doctor olga raquel if you can answer that um yeah so of course uh all studies of scientifical studies are done with high levels of mycotoxins in order to see really a pronounced effect and significant effect compared to the control group in the field we see different levels they are normally lower but again the effect depends a lot on combination of microtoxins if it's just one like aflatoxin or it's aflatoxin in combination with dawn with the uh with the aralenon for mononysines or don'ts the real one also can have synergistic effect and so on uh also it's important again that the status of animals julia already mentioned that the more animal is challenged with other factors stress factors the more susceptible it is if i just refer the levels like aflatoxins uh 5 to 15 ppb that probably you will not see the typical symptoms like liver issue but what you can see definitely it could be a lower response to vaccination same for the oxygen valinol uh in addition we even did a trial with 500 ppb of dioxin valinol and here uh there was a question regarding 250 750 so in average 500 was already significantly affecting the antibody titers against newcastle disease regarding the for monisius 500 100 1500 ppbs i would see a single for monitoring at this level would not really pose a big risk especially in poultry in poultry you would need elevated levels uh above 5000 ppv of four months in and higher pigs are more as susceptible to this mycotoxin and five to ten ppps of ochre toxin i would say there will be no big effect there's just a follow-up here question on that one they're asking about the combination of uh gom and for money in broilers normally these mycotoxins are recently studied together or single is precursors of gastrointestinal problems for instance necrotic enteritis but if we refer to the paper of gunter and donaldson from ghent university who did his phd on yoxini valeno and for monitoring the jokes in the valeno levels were really low in order to provoke necrotic enteritis for monizins you really need a high level in combination it's uh could be synergistic effect but i don't see a big issue at levels you mentioned so if you have 500 100 don and for instance 1 000 from one is in together that probably you will see more effects of dioxin in valeno and this will be a gastrointestinal integrity challenge and vaccination efficacy but i don't see that there will be issue typical for magnesium okay thank you next question um the question in spanish here i'm gonna translate is it important to also measure my toxins in the final feed on the pelleted feed for animals uh dr divorce can answer that um as we have just heard from hilda she mentioned that the feed analysis still are like golden standard for mycotoxin determination so we need to to analyze final feed to get the idea of what we have in the in the feed because we can analyze uh feed ingredients like corn or wheat and have some ideas what you could expect but the final feat is like mixture of all ingredients and yeah i think that the final fit analysis is like golden started so before before we we get this fit into our animals right okay thank you there's another question here asking um if the organs just like liver gallbladder and reproductive organs affected by microtoxins then how we improve the function of these organs um i don't know who prefers to answer that one dr porschkar i can do this so of course it depends uh how big is the damage and what is the organ because sometimes you can really help like liver or reproductive system to get rid of the toxic substance help to recover but sometimes changes are irreversible for instance if we speak about kidneys lungs so normally first what you have to do is just to prevent the further load of mycotoxins from the feed so you have to use really a product which is controlling the um [Music] the load of mycotoxins or decreasing the bioavailability of those mycotoxins and if we speak about liver and gallbladder of course some additives hepato protectors of my knowledge uh one of the best and fastest working in some herbal extracts with direct effects on liver like extract or seeds of milk festival rosemary maybe some vitamins as well a donor of missile groups can help for reproductive system you can get rid of mycotoxins in several days quite fast because it's a self cleaning if you remove mycotoxins from feed so you can see the effect within one week already for liver you would need a little bit longer okay yeah we have a time for one more question here um is there a critical age or period for laying hands and i'll also add uh breeders where my toxins affect more their performance and health dr julia um yes for breeders there are at least three critical periods one of them is the first week of the la their life when they are still developing all the systems like digestive system and they don't eat much so it's a very very important period in their life and if we have microtoxins during this period we will we can damage all their future development the second period is before the they are starting to lay and uh in this period they also have this their um development of reproductive system it is also very important if we have like zero knowledge in this period we will damage this development and we will not have the uh good development and number three we have a lot more time less time so a number three period is the after peak peak period of lane and again during this period the mating process will start soon and so it's very important to have the very good quality of feed to to have quality chicken and to have quality mating process and catchability fertility and all necessary parameters for the for the breeders thank you well then uh i think we got to the end of the one hour meeting that we had thank you very much all of you for joining us today and i hope to see you again on may 4th fourth uh episode of the michael info where we have dr peters rye talking about my toxin and oxidative stress thank you very much and matilds if you wanna just say a few words uh thank you goodbye thank you bye-bye