[Music] good morning good afternoon good evening welcome to all of you wherever you are to the first webinar new generation oh I should say to you or TV program fictional dot online every two months you'll have the opportunity to address some of your concern from the practical issue to the scientific explanations will expect from all over the world from University as well as industry for each webinar fee situation will be first addressed by testimonials from videos interviews from the field and then to scientific experts are keynote speakers will introduce a scientific basis to support this issue to explain those issues and then a roundtable will allow you to really ask your questions openly to these invitees it is our first fictional webinar today and we are pleased to welcome so many participants so I just remind you that you can at any time post your question on the site during the program now let's start with oxidative stress and its impact or animal protein production challenging its sustainability our animals are like sport at least they have a huge genetic potential but it might be quite fragile to express it and they can face a lot of stressful situation like hot conditions like subclinical disease or dietary imbalance or quality of the feed stuff but they have this stress situation and the also stress situation may have oxidative components and we proposed today to better understand those issues with our experts and our scientist today as a well-known professor peter Suri from Scotland that you all know with his huge and vast knowledge on antioxidants and oxidative mechanisms and up to man us tables from Universidad extremaduran Spain who is expert on meat quality from the muscle but to the meat after slaughter and also from pork to broilers now a week ago we interviewed doctor Fabrice problem from CCPA is R&D director of CCPs or so veteran onion in Johnson in France and he explained how we perceive the oxidative stress in young chicks as well as in piglets and how it is related to lots of issues animal production is facing so let's listen to fabrics from Bayer first I'm Fabrice Robbie I'm in charge of the R&D department of the CCPA group cpa group is a premier company when we are working with feed manufacturers the story about oxidative stress began here 12 13 years ago and we wanted to explore the relationship between stress situations in farms and nutrition is there some nutritional needs that we don't take into account when we formulate the feed during the specificities and what we found when exploring these specific phases of the life of animals is that during this stress situation we induce of this stress situation induce oxidative stress of cooling use oxidative stress and at the same time inflammation to stress induce an increased response of the innate immune system for example when we look at the level of oxidative stress measured through the level of hydroperoxide in the blood of chicks the day they come into the form and we relate that rely that with level of mortality during the 10 Thursday we can see a very good correlation and negative positive correlation sorry between the level of eyedropper oxidant bloods of the chicks the other under the forms and the mortality during the 10 first days so we can see that oxidative stress is a risks factor of our health and mortality in farms not only for the chicks but also for other species and at the same during the same trial we have seen that the level of acute phase protein that are used to evaluate the level of inflammation at mushara 10 days on the cheeks in the cheeks blood is correlated negatively with the growth of the cheeks so there is a game between oxidative stress on inflammation one of one of the both is inducing the other one but we don't know really the way it works but oxidative stress is inducing we most of the time we see the same things in all the spaces oxidative stress is increasing the risks of diseases and mortality and the inflammation is decreasing the productivity of animals and when what we have seen after the winning of piglets it's a high amount of hydro peroxide and blood of the piglets this in an educator of oxidative stress and a huge amount of acute phase protein also in the blood of animals this is a an indicator of high inflammation phenomenon on LC animals we can see anything from outside of the animals look healthy but they are not and that's this huge level of oxidative stress explain why the sensibility of animals is higher for diseases at that time and the high level of inflammation we know we all know that inflammation has high energy costs so it explains the decrease in growth and the decrease of feed efficiency at that specific period of time and probably the beginning of the story for the piglets at weaning in the gut we all know that we have inflammatory phenomena and get of the piglet just after the winning okay that if stress is not only a challenge at the animal level it's also a challenge for the one in charge of the product finally consumed we asked dr. Karim oukitel from LDC group in sebacio cert in France to explain us what are the challenge is facing and now oxidative stress is really perceived at the meat producing level let's listen to Jerry moco tell LDC is a French leader of poultry industry both on the retail and food service markets I am the person in charge of research and development within this company our first major concern is related to the progressive increase of muscle growth issues wooden breast white stripping Oregon disease both on chicken and turkey meets these problems are observed at a large scale in conventional and elaborated products we do not know precisely the origin of this defect we only can say that they have a very significant impact on meat quality we also have evidence of links between meat acidity and quality during shelf life this has been demonstrated especially on Turkey red meat a red meat with the lower pH is facing a bad evolution during shelf life particularly a negative change of correlation scientific studies have already given evidence on the relation between oxidative stress and meat pH as a conclusion I would like to say that these elements are key issues for us and have a very high economic impact these issues have to be solved if we want to deliver a consistent meat quality to our customers we got the concern from the industry and what else in facing day to day but is that oxidative stress per se and what is a fundamental basis of the mechanisms involved Peter can you help us to better understand what do we mean by oxidative stress and what are the basics mechanism we need to know to find solutions yes when we are talking about oxidative stress I would like to start from expressions that we are living in the dangerous world of free radicals and we need some kind of protection this means it's free radicals are produced in nature they are very dangerous they're very damaging and we need some kind of umbrella we means chickens piglets ourselves and this umbrella called anti oxen protection which is built from an toxins which are synthesized in our body coming from feeding gradients as well as from feed supplements and what are the what are free radicals so free radicals in a simple terms can be described as activated molecules of oxygen we know that oxygen is absolutely essential for human and animal life especially for energy production but once a molecule oxygen is activated becoming free radicals this molecule will be very damaging very dangerous and if we look at major sources of free radicals in nature of situation we could say that mitochondria are the major source of free radicals in biological system we know that mitochondria actually are responsible for energy production however the energy production has never been 100% efficient that's why some electron from electron transport chain can escape and produce so-called superoxide radicals and this superoxide radicals this is a first step of free radical production and the second source or major source of free radicals in biological systems are phagocytes sells for phagocytes cells production of free radicals is a Ness process they use free radicals as a weapon as a weapon to kill pathogens however we need to remember that free radicals can also damage phagocytes themselves therefore the antioxidant protection is a key for maintenance of effective phagocyte funds and free radicals are very old also are very important for signaling inside the body between cells and therefore to maintain this balance between free radical production and their scavenging by fear by antioxidant is a most important process in biology and we actually can consider three major levels of antioxidant defense as the first level we are talking about specific enzymes in particular superoxide dismutase which actually can convert it's a super acid radical into non radical products together with glutathione peroxidase catalase in some other elements however if we look how many of those radicals are produced in nature we are talking about at least 20 billions of free radicals to be produced in every cell every day the number is very high as this lamp in physiological conditions so it stress conditions this number will go up therefore the first level of and talks and defense is not portent enough to prevent damaging effect of these 20 billions of free radicals therefore there is a second level of defense and third level of defense and this three levels of antiques and defense in the cell are responsive for prevention of those damages which potentially free radicals can do for the cell and actually what we need to to know that in the cell and in the board in general all antioxidants are working together it's a team work and in this team every member has its own job to do so we can call vitamin E like headquarter one talks and defends carotenoids communicating services event works and defense vitamin C special forces of tox and Defense flavonoids antioxidant police and the selenium we can call chief executive of antioxidant defense chief executive means that there are at least 25 Selina proteins in animal and human body which are responsible for maintaining and to oxidant defenses for maintaining other processes in the body and they are regulating antioxidant system in general and if we look at the cell we can see that practically every part of the cell is protected we can talk about membranes where polyunsaturated fit is it can be easily oxidized and damages to membrane can take place we are talking about cytosol we are talking about nucleus where DNA can be damaged therefore natural antioxidants are distributed within the cell and in every part of the cell is well protected by antioxidants and the most important point I'm making today that there is a very delicate balance between antioxidants and Providence and depending which part of the balances will go down we are talking about good and talks and protection maintenance of growth development and health or alternatively if the another part of the balances goes down due to high production of free radicals or high stress conditions or just bins balanced diet we were talking about free radical overproduction and damages to healthy tissues which eventually will actually affect productive and reproductive performance of animals they will affect animal health their foods for the nutrition is the most important task is to maintain this balance which is responsible for growth development productive and reproductive performance one side of these balances like God Hills when we look at the God there is a delicate balance between antiques and Pro oxidants and we need to take care of it or alternatively if we look at the in general is a cell this balance is determinant many physiological functions and this balance actually is a redox balance of the cell and we know today that the redox balance of the cell is responsible for actuation of may or expression of many different genes therefore this is a fundamental balance which we need to take care of and if we took if we come and back to stresses we know that in commercial animal production in poultry production in pig production and in general any actually animal production system there are plenty of stresses and we cannot avoid them and therefore those stresses actually increase free radical production and for the last 20 years more and more information has been accumulated to show that as a molecular level most of stresses in animal production are related to oxidative stress are related this balance between free radical production and antioxidant defense and therefore the nutritional means of preventing damages by those free radicals is a key issue for nutritionists in poultry production in pit production and generally speaking if we look at the effect of those free radicals the first effect we can look at the reproduction why because the spermatozoa of chicken or pigs or bulls they are they contain high proportion of polyunsaturated fatty acid and these PDS are very vulnerable to lipid oxidation they are very sensitive to lipid oxidation and then we need and tox than defense a good balance between antioxidant proceeds to maintain the structure of spermatozoa and in particular one case we can describe like in selenium see we actually can see damages to the neck of spermatozoa so when Nikhil spermatozoa is damaged there is no motility normativity no fertility as simple as there therefore to provide optimal antioxidant supplementation with the diet is a key issue to maintain semen quality in animal and poultry production and if we go further in terms of effect of radical on health the most important part is actually effect of overproduction of radicals to immune system the problem is that the immune system is very complex system very important system but very sensitive to free radicals because we know that immune system includes billions of lymphocytes and millions of phagocytes and all these cells are responsible for immunocompetence for protection of the body from in Weider's and these cells must do work together again it's again a team work and all these different types of immune cell must talk to each other to make a decision how to deal with the situation and if you ask a question how they communicated between a Isha's and the recipient says mobile phone something like mobile phones which we call receptors are responsible for communication between different immune cells and what's happened in stress conditions and stress conditions those damaging free radicals can actually break those communication devices and once the communication is broken the immunocompetence goes down and all those billions and and millions of immune cells will not be effective in protection therefore to maintain anti oxidant provoke Siddhant balance to maintain high antioxidant defense is a key and we also need to mention that there is a process of adaptation to stresses and this process of adaptation is going through activation of different transcription factors and this redox balance I mentioned already the redox balance is responsible for activation of various transcription factors and to maintain adaptation to stress and as a loose illustration from the biological point of view how actually aunt works and protection can deal with oxidative stress we can consider for example the issue with selenium because we know that selenium is a chief executive of antioxidant defense I mentioned already there are 25 cellular proteins and they are responsible first of all foreign torques and defense it's proven that at least half of cellular proteins are involved in and talks and defense they are also responsive for the dogs balance is a cell they are responsible maintain in sperm structure they are responsible for regulation of thyroid metabolism as well as the protein folding and protein quality in the body therefore if we look at those cellular proteins what they do they actually prevent oxidative stress they prevent damage is done by free radicals therefore the message the major message of all myself today is we need to balance antioxidant and pro-oxidant we need to make sure that balance is optimal in optimal to maintain animal health and this will give us good productive and reproductive performance and of course economical return thank you Peter you mentioned in fact the link between oxidative stress and immune system Fabricio bear in his interview address the link between oxidative stress and inflammation it seems that you agree all together on the link between oxidative stress in doses yes actually inflammation is a part of the activity of immune system and we know that there are different transcription factors in the board and one of them called NF kappa-b this transcription factor specifically responsive for synthesis pro-inflammatory cytokines therefore the activation of this fact responsible for inflammation and what is also important that this transcription factor is under the control redox balance therefore when we have excess of free radicals redox balance in change this transcription factor is activated and we have the process which we cannot control inflammation therefore the task for nutritionists to make sure that this antioxidant balance is correct then the level of information will be minimum as it is needed and everything will be all right therefore we will maintain immune system in the best possible immuno computer status thank you Peter when addressing oxidation and oxidative stress we all think about animals but the stress facing by animal we forget sometimes the consequence on the product produced like the meat and I think it's important Myers if you can help us to better understand the basis of oxidation and the consequence on the mid quality and particularly your soda may default making a very clear statement a very clear idea that meat quality should be our main concern whenever we are talking about poultry production because this is actually the ultimate purpose of poultry production or livestock production to sell the product the final product in this case they needs so we really need to preserve meat quality so we can actually use the most prolific and proficient genetic breeds we can use the best and most optimized feeds from the market and we can handle the animals with extreme care but if the final consumer is not satisfied then we actually have a problem so meat quality should be preserved and actually oxidation is a main threat to meat quality in terms of sensory properties oxidation is able to spoil the sensory properties of meat in terms of flavor other texture and also the appearance the color of meat and there is an increasing concern among consumers in relation to the connection between meat intake and some health concerns and actually oxidation is playing a major role in that connection which is something that we have to take into consideration but oxidation is not only relevant from the consumer point of view prosze from the industrial point of view is in fact oxidation is also a major threat to the technological suitability of meats that means that oxidation for instance is able to reduce the shelf-life of meats when they are in the retail display particularly for affecting the color of meats of red meats like in this case like for instance beef or turkey and then also a oxidation is responsible for spoiling that technological properties of needs so that when oxidation is present the successful production of some particular muscle foods can be compromised because the water holding capacity then some other functional properties of meat can actually be impaired can be affected so now that we know that oxidation is actually critical for meat quality I'm going to tell something more about it because as Peter said oxidation of course takes place in the living animal but also afterwards in the meats after it slaughter then it is actually very sensitive to oxidation due to some biochemical changes taking place after a slaughter during the transfer transformation of muscle intimates what we call aging meat aging then we have a collection of factors such as the collapse of the waste of some of antioxidant defenses also the release of peroxides the pH decline and then the exposure of the meats to air to oxygen all these factors are creating a very intense proxy dn't environment in the meats so that the meat is really sensitive to oxidation and after a slaughter during storage and during processing and cooking of course any technological process that we may apply to the meat will increase the susceptibility of lipids and proteins to oxidation and I would like to highlight something relevant at this point is that whenever oxidation takes place at a particular stage like for instance in the living animal the cause this will not only be suffered by that animal the cause the negative consequences of oxidation will also appear later in the following stages for instance in the mids the meat from animals that suffered this that oxidative stress will also be more susceptible to oxidation with consequences on meat quality so it is relevant to recognize the negative consequences of lipid and protein oxidation at every stage so that we can identify the problem that we have and then develop or apply a specific antioxidant solution for our problem for instance whenever oxidation takes place in the living animal in vivo that usually leads to a low meat quality and low technological suitability we probably have acid meat meat with a low pH or fast pH decline that leads to PSE or PSE like meats and then some other myopathies like those mentioned before by the industrial partner that white stripe in the wooden breast and at this stage it is extremely relevant to have some kind of antioxidant strategy in this case the nutritional strategies are really critical are really paramount using this in this stage we can enhance the oxidative stability of animal tissues by manipulating the feats that we are giving to the animals in terms of modifying the fatty acid composition or including some anti oxidant additives and in that the interesting point about these nutritional strategies is that as well as the oxidative damage when we have this antioxidant protection is not only for the animal when the animal is slaughtered those animals the meat from those animal animals will also be protected afterwards during the storage and during processing which is actually very interesting after it slaughter when oxidation takes place in the meat during storage or aging usually also leads to low meat quality and in this particular case protein oxidation is actually playing a critical role even more than lipid oxidation because protein oxidation is believed to be responsible for a low water holding capacity which is reflected in a trip loss the loss of water during processing or dryness it's also responsible for increased toughness hotness of the meat and it's also responsible for some color problems which actually reducing the self-life of meat at this stage of course we can apply some antioxidant solutions at this stage when the meat is displayed using a suitable packaging or even including some anti oxidant additives and finally during processing and cooking lipid oxidation is very typically reflected or manifested as their own set of rancidity and also some other off flavors and protein oxidation again is usually reflected as low water holding capacity in the meat and also which is in a way which is effecting in turn some other quality traits such as juiciness and and hardness and then in this case we can also apply some technological edge strategies based on food formulation and also try to optimize some technological processes so that we keep oxidation at low levels before going to the end of my of my speech I would like to talk about the increased incidence of some emerging chicken breast defects such as the white striping and the wooden breast both are myopathies and both are becoming or they are actually right now at this moment real headaches for a lot of poultry producers basically because we don't know which are the causes the reasons behind the the onset of the incidence of this new myopathies and because we don't know which are the underlying mechanisms of these pathogenesis so it's difficult to fight against the problem try to reduce the incidence of both myopathies and what we know for certain is that both myopathies are related to big animals to fast growth and that is that is actually in that we can find the connection between these myopathies and the oxidative stress because a big animal with fast growth accelerated metabolism probably the production of rapper of free radicals is higher that in a let's say normal animal with the normal growth and those free radicals can actually perform biology biological damage and also in a way there are some recent studies proving that they may be involved in the up regulation of some particular genes involves in the file in the in the fibrosis and and the lipid OSIS that actually are some symptoms of this myopathies so anyway that now going to the end of my of my speech I would like to to give some take-home messages in a way I understand that one main concern of industrial partners is to keep the business alive and well and to me one very good advice is to keep the consumer satisfied this thesis as I said before the ultimate purpose of bones reduction to have meat that is actually appreciated by consumers so we have to keep the consumer satisfied we have to focus on meat quality and then also we have to keep the firm sustainable if we want to keep poultry production in left livestock production alive and well for a long time period we really have to make it sustainable and that means that maybe we have to change a little bit their priorities in animal production maybe to make it as low Lea may be you have to focus on the quality of the feeds because the quality of the pits will be reflected afterwards in the quality of the food in this case the the needs or the X and definitely we have to make it sustainable and I think that the in the near future these are the the issues that should be covered Thank You Mario so yeah boss interested in fact by the consumer the final consumers final products and so from the sustainable to the quality of the of the products so my questions right during your presentation and we try to to answer to some of the questions or at least many of the main topics but I would like to remind people that you still can post questions on the website during the discussion so to start I suggest to take the first question please okay do mycotoxin in raw material induce oxidative stress I may ask maybe Peter to start to answer on that yeah an interesting question and I've been working on this subject for number of years and publishing a few papers and reviews and the major conclusion is that at the molecular level most of mycotoxins in poles oxidative stress we can talk about t2 toxin which mainly impose oxidative stress in the god and damage in god actually will will cost a lot of poultry and pig production produces we are talking about dawn we are talking about ochratoxin aflatoxin for munitions so generally speaking most of micro toxins actually impose oxidative stress most of mica toxins are immunosuppressive because this oxidative stress as I mentioned before can damage those communication devices and most of micro toxin impose apoptosis which is a program cell death therefore from the point of view of nutritionists to deal with mycotoxins is very important but it's very difficult questions because there is no magic bullet there is no full solution for this problem to a in animal industry because on the markets are playing to various solutions including a various absorbance but we need to be realistic there is no in its orbit which can absorb hundred percent of those mycotoxins therefore part of them may be 30% to 40% can escape those binding and they will go to the liver where they will be detoxified and during the duck toxification the process the liver can the damage they have antioxidant supplementation antioxidant strategy is a key to deal with those mycotoxins on the other side dawn is mainly metabolized in the god again we need to maintain that balance between an toxins and rocks and things a god to make sure that the toxification of the goal is going well therefore from the point of view of nutritionists we need to have in place a good antioxidant strategy to deal with those micro toxins which actually which are damaging God which are damaging liver and which actually decrease productive and reproductive performance thank you Peter you want to add some well actually Peter is that true expert in this field but of course I can add something because in fact as I said before it is not possible to have a good meat quality without having a good feed quality so mycotoxins is one of those factors that has have to be controlled because in fact they have an impact on the on the animal and also an impact on the final end and the final product so in a way decisions that we make at the farm has consequences on the final products and this is something that we have to take into consideration the feeds should be of high quality and of course the the presence of mycotoxins is is something that we should avoid as much as possible thank you another question coming from the web that's may be related to which we see before these oxidized fat in the diet a source of oxidative stress and I think it's quite interesting because we talk about the stress as the gut cleaver but how can you link that oxidized fat and oxidative stress there is definitely a linkage in here yes in fact because not only for animals also for human beings it is proven that whenever we intake oxidized lipids and oxidized proteins right after that there is an increase of in the level of some lipid and protein oxidation markers in the blood and urine and some of the tissues so it is very clear than that so some lipid and protein oxidation products some oxidized amino acids and then some low molecular lipid oxidation products they are present in the food and then of course after intake they will be in contact with the intestinal mucosa and actually they are having some some activity in there and actually Peter can actually talk about that because you know we affect the God's health not only in animals but also in human beings and then after that there is distel uptake so they are absorbed and that they go through the bloodstream and they are distributed to different organs and so obviously there is a direct impact of what we can call dietary oxidative stress and then oxidative stress is what is basically an array an increase of oxidation products in our blood in the in our tissues and then they will have some negative consequences so definitely returning to the idea that feeds should be controlled in terms of quality we should avoid using feeds with high oxidation oxidation levels and then also take me to the idea that polyunsaturated fatty acids are also dangerous in feeds because they are very sensitive to oxidation Aries is more likely to have high oxidation rates when we are having feeds and reached in polyunsaturated fatty acids unless we include of course some antioxidants naturally but thank you and Maya maybe Peter you can add some comments on that and yes the god level as I mention it is there is a delicate balance between antioxidants and Pro oxidants and oxidized fat which is common from the diet is a major contributor to the Pro oxidant part and we need to realize that the quality of the fat in the diet is related to the price of the diet so sometimes producers are looking for cheap fat and if this ship fat is oxidized there could be consequences we can look for examples a breeder side because what happens at was part of the oxidized fat can be transferred into the egg and then during embryonic development it's imposing additional oxidative stress which will be related to increased mortality during embryonic development and postnatal development and we know today is that you know the maternal nutrition is a key actually for the productive and reproductive performance of progeny so on this side at the side of epigenetics we now can say that it's very dangerous to play with oxidized fat at least in the breeder died we know that oxidized fat can have negative consequences for broilers and for other animals but when we talking about breeding animals it could be saw what it could be a chicken breeder or poultry bidder then in this site we need to avoid as much as possible Oxygen's fat which are cheap but cheap does not mean effective therefore from this point of view supplementation with antioxidants the antioxidant system maintenance is a key issue to actually prevent those damages which oxidized fat can actually impose thank you Peter maybe you know self question from the web you say free radicals are used as weapons against bacteria play role of messenger what about - hi aunty excellent intake and actually too much so good see it could be bad things and because generally speaking if we look at the immune system this very very delicate balance is responsible not only for production of free radicals which is under the control of the cell but the signaling signaling processes are very important to maintain that protection to the actually to the maximum I feel a efficiency and therefore too much okay there is not much actually evidence but Sarah some publication says that overdose of vitamin E probably can affect immune systems it could be one examples that too much of goods in kill it can be bad if we look at the selenium side we know that high dose of selenium can especially in the form of solenoid can impose oxidative stress and this will be also bad and in general terms when we look at the diet in general we have plain tuned various antioxidant compounds and we need to make sure that we have the optimal balance i'm talking about i mentioned in my figures that for example flavonoids are considered as aunty works and police and there are plenty of publications actually claim means that flavonoids are very good antioxidants however if you look more closely what is done with them they are very good and toxins in the tube they are very good and since even in vitro they might do a good job with meat quality when you add them directly into the meat however they are not well absorbed therefore they can do probably a good job in the god but beyond the god it's not the direct antioxidant effect yes they probably can affect transcription factors and be involved in other mechanism of you know maintaining a one-two action system but we cannot say two days that flavonoids in saliva have direct for example in saliva have direct an talks and effects therefore for the nutritionist it's a difficult job to finds it proper balance which gives the best results in terms of stability one two or sentence a field stability antioxidants and their absorption in the god and the delivery source and to extend to target tissue when they can have that effect and therefore to final finalize this answer to that question yes too much of a good thing could be bad therefore the balance is a key so our job as this is more difficult in fact you have to balance but we have also to deal before the absorption and after the absorption when we look at the meat as being so well in fact I think that the question is actually very pertinent and very clever and and the situation is very complex particular particular with flavonoids with these phenolic compounds what they are usually called natural antioxidants and here we also have the disconnection between animal nutrition and human nutrition as well because you know some of these compounds some vitamins like vitamin E vitamin A and vitamin C as well as flavonoids they are sometimes used as soon additional supplements and there are actually many studies carried out by accredited and really famous and and recognized experts in the field stating that actually they are not as good as they appear let's say that probably we shouldn't call them antioxidants at least they are not antioxidants always so we probably should refer as redox active compounds sometimes they act as antioxidants depending on the concentration the dose and also the circumstances and sometimes they act as per oxidants and something that making is making everything even more complicated is that sometimes their proxied and actions of some of those phenolic compounds can actually be positive in a way that whenever this proxy dn't is in the body is sent in some kind of message to the to the to the to the tissues of that okay now we have to synthesize more endogenous antioxidant defenses so a little dose of proxy Danks a redox compound sometimes is good so that to maintain and to keep a good antioxidant status in the body so everything is very complicated and for phenolic compounds it is really really complicating that we have ahead a lot a lot of studies that we have to carry out to understand the biological effects of these compounds function so it's really important to to look at the complexity but also try to clarify sorry to interrupt in you that absolutely matter is absolutely rides it for our nodes actually fake transcription factors being pro oxidants so they are effect on actually anti oxygen system not due to antioxidant property but more Pro oxidant properties that's there's a complicated things but we know that they are still important part of the animal nutrition thank you maybe we have another question what is a difference between mid pack Eurasian and mid conservation oxidative mechanisms involved in both issues and that's quite something very very interesting I would you talked about before meat aging with maturation so we are there are several several concepts and sometimes they are mistaken meat maturation or what we usually say meat aging is the period of time that goes from this letter to at the point in which we consider meat as such so something that we can eat or we can use as a raw material for producing some other muscle foods and then of course after a slaughter the meat is something that we need to preserve because it's a very easily spoiled by microorganisms so in a way that during for trying to find the connection between the meat maturation and meat conservation in a way that during that period of time of meat maturation we really need to apply some kind of strategy to keep the meat in good conditions that mean that means that we need to control microbial growth that's the first issue and then of course we should also control oxidation you need to preserve exactly so this aging is actually a very critical period of time sometimes it's overlooked which is actually critical particularly for red meats because during that period of time there are a set of biochemical changes including for instance the proteolysis carried out by some endogenous protease that in the present in the meat and that is actually making the meat more and more tender for instance this is called the tenderization process of meat which is actually we have to do anything it's just to let the meats H which is the this aging idea and then the meat will be more tender and so on but of course that the colored is a different issue which is actually directly connected to oxidation to myoglobin oxidation so it's a very critical critical period in which we have set of biochemical reactions some of the some of them the consequences some of them are very good like the tenderization some of them like the oxidation of the myoglobin is not so good because he's turning oxy myoglobin which is the responsible for the red bright color of fresh meat into the metal myoglobin which is responsible for the brown color of meat that has been aged so motivated for for a long time so it's a very interesting question but maybe also very complex very complex tanker now you may be another question for from the web oxidative impairs male fertility what about female acid often question shows as family defects and so on but what happens as if you may live a yeah if you look at the female level let's take the chicken first so we can have a look at the egg we put the egg into the hatchery and during 21 days we will have a chicken so what's happened first of all egg yolk contains pretty high proportion of polyunsaturated fatty acids and those fatty acid can be oxidized and more importantly during embryonic development embryo synthesize in polyunsaturated fatty acids and the level of polyunsaturated fat is in the newly hot chicken is most doubled in comparison to say X so we're talking about more than 50% of total fatty acid in the newly hatched chick liver are unsaturated therefore they are very sensitive to oxidation we know that hatching process itself is a oxidative stress because we have higher temperature at the time of people we have oxygen coming in we have high humidity so this impose oxidative stress and therefore the antics and defense of the egg yolk could be a key to get a viable chick that's a one side if we look at the female side from the people South for example yes so also is under the stress in stress conditions and as a piglet bores is also stressed and again high proportion of polyunsaturated fatty acid a newly born piglet impose oxidative stress and they are very sensitive and therefore what they get they get antioxidant from colostrum and milk and this is the most critical part of the development of the piglet to get as much as possible into oxidants to colostrum and meal however there are some restriction on that one restriction in terms that placenta is not good for transferring them therefore for nutritionist it's a bit of headache how to deal with it how to provide optimal antioxidant defenses for newly born piglet for newly born chicken or any other animals okay thank you very much Peter maybe maybe we have elastic question regarding the main stresses faced by young animals you talked about the cheeks you talked about the piglets do we consider that the births and the hatching is movies when was the critical issue yeah actually when you talk about production commercial animal production of commercial poultry production the stresses if we look at the poultry production stresses started from placement egg into hatchery during incubation period the hatching process is stress then we have transport or we have hold in time after hatching chicks are in boxes waiting to be delivered to the polity house that's another stress then during transportation especially if we're talking about about breeder chicks which can travel fuel one or two days maybe by plane between different country this is a NASA stress then the placement itself in the poultry house with high temperature with high humidity and was changing all the feed because you know that you're an embryonic development last week of embryo development she can actually consume exclusively protein and lipids and when they face a feed in supportive our house it's mainly a carbohydrates there's a lot of changes which are stressful then we have vaccinations vaccinations are also impose stress that we can we mention already mycotoxins we can talk about other stresses like transferring birds from rearing houses to breathe houses then coming to the peak production it's also very high stress because when we are talking about layers which can come 97 98 of leg and a percentage it's a very high stress for the liver because the most compounds of the egg is synthesized in saliva therefore as you see the whole rose is a stress stress stress if we look as a pig side it's still the same because a time of firing it's a very high stress for some then we have been in time so the villain is a big stress for the piglet again changing from the milk into the drive feed which is a this transition period is very difficult in many cases feed con consumption goes down and piglet can actually lose some weight then after that one we get still having some vaccinations a change in feed it's also stressed so to actually summarize the there are plenty of those traces in animal production we cannot avoid them we do our best to decrease those stresses but the nutritional strategy it's a key the nutritional strategy is a key because the most of an toxins important antioxidants are common with the feed and it behaves it optimal balance it will give us the highest productive and reproductive performance and high economical return thank you Peter so more question have been posted on the web so we will not address all the questions unfortunately but you will get the answers in the days and following weeks I would like to warmly sound our today's speakers from the industry and from these ions and I think you have accepted to be the guinea pigs of our first TV program our first new type of webinar so I think really we wanna thank you first you will be able to listen to all the interviews presentations and discussions on the web through a podcast and we hope you enjoy this first webinar and that's it's only the start of the new theory and I think you will be addicted in the future to this series so we give you a point mount for the next fictional program that will be on the 13th of December you will be informed on due time you will receive email you'll receive notifications so this next webinar will be on go tell so you will see the link between the oxidative stress I would say and now going to see your gut cells so I would say I couldn't not be a good guy without something also the three person behind the screens that manipulated and organized the questions from the web so Sophia McKeon and Sonia so thanks very much and bye bye everyone and looking forward to seeing you in December [Music]